Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !!!!

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Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !!!!

Postby floppydesk » 18 Apr 2015, 16:21

<RANT>

I find it stupid that the amount of kids/teenagers/adults cycling in the kings lynn town centre is disgusting during daytime hours.
You have to jump out their way or get knocked over, when you mention POLITELY that it`s not for Cycling on , you get subjected to Verbal and physical abuse and told to **** Off !!
POLICE DO NOT WANT TO KNOW , THEY WONT DO ANYTHING !!!, Heaven forbid if someone dies as a result of injuries from being knocked over.
The Jobless 16-25`s are the worst offenders as they are the most reckless and do not give a flying **** if they hit anyone.

</RANT>

Now for a nice calming cup of tea :)
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby MJR » 20 Apr 2015, 18:00

The police do occasionally stop people from riding in the town centre and fine them, but the basic problem is that good people are told by signs not to ride in most of the town centre, so the only cyclists who ride there are either a few civil-disobedience types, or the irresponsible/reckless ones.

If an irresponsible one "buzzes" you or hit-and-runs, then everyone nearby is walking and can't follow them. Even the police cyclists won't usually ride on the pedestrianised streets (I think they're allowed anyway), so most of those who get caught have to be daft enough to ride towards a police officer who is on foot!

If the red "no cycling" and stupid blue "cyclists dismount" signs were replaced by the green "Shared Space - Give Way To Pedestrians" sign (a clearer one in grey or here is an older version) as happens in many other towns and cities across England and Europe (picture attached), then there would be good examples of how to behave for the thoughtless ones and if they hit anyone, there would be people who could follow them until the police arrived!

So let's open Norfolk Street, Tower Street, Sedgeford Lane, High Street and Purfleet Street to cycling with clear signs saying to give way to pedestrians - make them keep to the carriageway (which is still marked in the paving) and off the footway, away from shop doorways - and I bet most of the problem cyclists would be brought into line before very long.

Cycling in an Italian pedestrianised shopping street...

Image
Last edited by MJR on 20 Apr 2015, 19:42, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby novasinistra » 20 Apr 2015, 19:07

It would certainly be worth giving this idea a trial.
Cycling through K.L is anything but straightforward!
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby MJR » 23 Apr 2015, 11:43

I just noticed yesterday that following various resurfacing works, at least three entrances onto High Street seem to have no signs prohibiting traffic. All are obstructed, so few motor vehicles can get through, but I suspect the pedestrian zone restrictions may be unenforceable at the moment if people ride in from those entrances.

Of course, careless or reckless cycling remains illegal everywhere and the police have the powers to deal with it.
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby floppydesk » 29 Apr 2015, 23:17

MJR wrote:The police do occasionally stop people from riding in the town centre and fine them, but the basic problem is that good people are told by signs not to ride in most of the town centre, so the only cyclists who ride there are either a few civil-disobedience types, or the irresponsible/reckless ones.


The civil-disobedience types you are referring to are 18-30 range. Most are in the Local naughty book that all shops have for shoplifters , etc. Ive seen people from 14-80 Cycling in the town centre without any regard for pedestrians. As a example a while back i came out of Poundland with some items and a cyclist came through very fast within 3 ft of the entrance and nearly took a pensioner out and myself, He met his match 30 ft down the street when he cycled into one of them yellow planters in the centre of the street and went head first over it. I walked up their and when i came to him i was laughing my ass off. He shouted four letter abuse and i just said " that`ll teach you for Cycling In the Town Centre " he rode off again, ranting and raving. Reported to Police , nothing done, they are not interested.

Ive not seen a POLICE MAN/WOMAN EVER fine a cyclist !! Ive seen a Police Woman in the last week , tell a 18 year old male to get off a bike , hes got off the bike and walked maybe 10 ft and then got back on it after shes turned around and hes promptly swearing and erecting a middle finger while riding off. Only a matter of time before someone is seriously injured!!!

As for the signs , they want to be BIG RED ONES , informing people , you cycle in the town centre , you get FINED £80 and your BIKE TAKEN AWAY !!
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby MJR » 30 Apr 2015, 10:04

floppydesk wrote:The civil-disobedience types you are referring to are 18-30 range. Most are in the Local naughty book that all shops have for shoplifters , etc.

The civil-disobedience types are the ones who believe that cycling should be allowed in the town centre and ignore the traffic regulation orders prohibiting cycling because they believe the orders were made improperly, not following the legal processes correctly, that it was not for a reason Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984. Many of these are well over 30... The ones in the naughty book are more likely the reckless ones who would probably get stopped for bad riding even if there wasn't an unnecessary cycling ban in the town centre.

Ive not seen a POLICE MAN/WOMAN EVER fine a cyclist !! Ive seen a Police Woman in the last week , tell a 18 year old male to get off a bike , hes got off the bike and walked maybe 10 ft and then got back on it after shes turned around and hes promptly swearing and erecting a middle finger while riding off. Only a matter of time before someone is seriously injured!!!

Get real! When a person riding a bike seriously injures someone, it makes national news - it's that rare. Even minor injuries get onto regional news, like the one in London last week (although the tabloids played it up "scarred for life" and so on). Why would anyone be injured? The only reported cycle-involved collision on the restricted streets in the last decade was a car "dooring" a cyclist in Norfolk Street (hopefully that car was one of the ones allowed there for loading or access). There are no reported cycle-pedestrian collisions.

And just because you've not seen a rider being fined doesn't mean it doesn't happen... It's rather easier to spot a motorist being fined because they have a big metal box blocking the way while they're fined and usually the police officer fining them has another big metal box in dayglow colours with flashing lights.
As for the signs , they want to be BIG RED ONES , informing people , you cycle in the town centre , you get FINED £80 and your BIKE TAKEN AWAY !!

Like people get their cars taken away if they're ever fined for a motoring offence...??? :lol:

The signs want to be green/blue ones, allowing cycles but making it clear pedestrians have priority, like the ones I rode past in London last week. Hasn't the decade-plus of red sign failure shown that trying to ban it doesn't work? It only keeps out the good people on bikes.
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby dr strangelove » 30 Apr 2015, 15:42

Just a quick question for Flippydesk. Where do you stand on the Tour de France when the "spectators" get in the way of the cyclists? Any thoughts?
Roses are red, violets are blue, I'm schizophrenic, and so am I.
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby banjo » 02 May 2015, 19:14

The jobless 16-25 year olds, as you put it, who are riding through the town,maybe just late for a job interview or a meeting with their social worker perhaps? I think we need to give them a break, and stop stereotyping all young people on bikes as losers, bless them. The youngsters of today have it hard, and you could always move out of their way if they're cycling towards you? As for the adults on bikes, I think they either need to get a life, or a car! 8)
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby MJR » 05 May 2015, 16:04

banjo wrote:As for the adults on bikes, I think they either need to get a life, or a car! 8)

Oh grow up yourself ;) For journeys of 5 miles or under, bikes make clear sense around King's Lynn, especially for journeys where the roads are busy with commercial traffic and cycleways are available: almost no queues (so it's often as fast if not faster), easy parking almost everywhere, health benefits, ... but it's pretty silly that there's cycle parking on High Street and Broad Street behind signs telling people not to ride there. We know that won't work: loads of motorists ignore the sign telling them not to drive into the small Boal Quay car park.
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby banjo » 06 May 2015, 14:29

That's not really a very grown up attitude to have mjr, to just be rude! Everyone has their own opinion, I'm sorry if you don't agree with mine, just saying that not all youngsters are wrong uns, and it was all a bit tongue in cheek about moving out of the way of cycles. But it is a bit sad when adults are still riding around the town on cycles? You must agree?? :roll:
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby EWW » 06 May 2015, 14:48

The centre of our town which is a pedestrianised area is very small. If the idiots (in my mind)
cannot walk and push their bikes in said area to keep women, men, the elderly and very young
safe it is a bad ol thing, for this is why the aeras set up in the first place. It takes me literaley
minutes to walk round the whole town centre and I aint no spring chicken.
I do not want thanks for any research I am able to help out with. I just love doing it.
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby MJR » 06 May 2015, 14:56

The town centre cycling ban has never been justified on safety grounds. It's just been tacked onto the motor vehicle ban since that was the default thing to do. As you can tell from the initial rant, it doesn't even work and the problematic reckless riding would be illegal whether or not there's a ban. We don't ban cars from the A10 because there's occasionally a nutter driving a car on it - heck, we don't even ban them from the TMP during the Mart!

Edit: Also, I think it's poor form to call people who can't push their bikes "idiots". Have you ever helped someone lift a tricycle through some of the barriers on Lynn's cycleways? They're not lightweight things and often used by people who have restricted mobility. Telling them to get off and push to reach a cycle park is basically disability discrimination, isn't it?

Sorry banjo - I sometimes reply with rudeness to rudeness like being told to get a life or a car. I don't think it's sad when adults are riding bikes, especially in a beautiful old town like King's Lynn where the streets are far better suited to bikes than cars. Far from it. In the words of H G Wells "When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race."
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby bill » 06 May 2015, 20:20

well you wont see a policeman round town as motor cars are banned, never see one anymore the only one is the cardboard cut out,
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby EWW » 06 May 2015, 20:36

MJR wrote:
Edit: Also, I think it's poor form to call people who can't push their bikes "idiots". Have you ever helped someone lift a tricycle through some of the barriers on Lynn's cycleways? They're not lightweight things and often used by people who have restricted mobility. Telling them to get off and push to reach a cycle park is basically disability discrimination, isn't it?



We are not talking about Lynns cycleways we are talking about the town pedestrianised centre.

Geoff Wagg is the only person I have seen on a trike and even he has enough sense to stay
out of the centre. In the main I have only ever seen fit young morons, and I know some
of them by name riding through the pedestrian town centre. And I do not appologise for calling
them morons in the least.
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Re: Cyclists riding in pedestrianised areas in Town Centre !

Postby MJR » 07 May 2015, 11:57

EWW wrote:We are not talking about Lynns cycleways we are talking about the town pedestrianised centre.

Geoff Wagg is the only person I have seen on a trike and even he has enough sense to stay
out of the centre. In the main I have only ever seen fit young morons, and I know some
of them by name riding through the pedestrian town centre. And I do not appologise for calling
them morons in the least.

Most of the so-called "pedestrianised centre" still has marked carriageways which motor vehicles still use, but you're missing the point: do you know how hard it is to push or lift a trike or other adapted cycle?

I don't know Geoff Wagg but I know some other trike riders and yes, I think most of them don't go into the town centre any more. It seems a shame that some don't want more people going into the town centre more often and using its shops.
bill wrote:well you wont see a policeman round town as motor cars are banned, never see one anymore the only one is the cardboard cut out,

The bans don't apply "for fire brigade, police or ambulance purposes" amongst others but I see police on foot in town fairly often. There was one or two shadowing the Mayday parade last Friday, for example.
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